Starter problems

[Carl Hammond]

Hi everyone.

Ahh the joys of owning a classic car, one minute you're cruising around in the glorious sunshine living the dream and the next you're rooted on your driveway! Well, that's exactly what happened to me yesterday...

I started her up yesterday morning, she fired at first turn of the key (and that's after 2 weeks sitting in the garage). Took her for about a 10 mile spin (was driving like a dream) Got home, had a spot of lunch went back out to head out again, turned the key...she turned over...nothing! Tried this about a dozen times, still would not fire up!

Started to go through possible problems;

Hot start issue? Left the car for a couple of hours, tried again...still no joy.

Battery? Registering at just under 10 volts when you put ignition on, bit low I thought, so charged it for a few hours (not fully) put it back in charged to just over 10 volts... but still nothing on start up.

However, before having to roll her back into the garage last night (easier said than done!) I tried to start her again...no joy once again BUT I did notice one thing, I couldn't hear the relay noise that primes the fuel pump on the ignition key 2 position. Tried this a couple of times and definately no sound?

Is this likely to be the cause?

Thinking back about this should you hear this sound every time you put the ignition key in position 2? As it doesn't always activate every turn on mine...

Also, something else to bare in mind is my car is a bit tempremental with electrics, so may be an issue there?

As always any help is much appreciated on this, thanks guys.

Kind regards

[stunned_monkey]

Probably something in the fuel pump electrics - the noise you describe. I'm sure someone will jump in with detail but feel free to give me a ring if you want me to talk you through it - listing every possibility gets a little longwinded and the chances are that it'll be something smple.

[Tourettes Tony]

mine does that sometimes even if i use it they dont seem to catch for some reason funny cars :lol: TT

[Carl Hammond]

Just been out to quickly try her again, she's still just churning over but not firing.

Having turned the key to position 2 a number of times again, I am absolutely convinced the relay is where the problem is.

Normally, I would it prime the fuel pump. However, it is definately not happening. Usually, (and I know this is not the correct technical term) I would hear a whirring noise followed by a click this would last for roughly about 2 seconds. Now all I hear is the click after the 2 seconds?

I must stress that I am only a beginner at this (everyone has to start somewhere), but I would really love to try and fix this myself as it would be very rewarding.

Are there any basic tests I can do to start with?

Thanks

Kind regards

[Dodgy Motor]

inertia switch??nearside kick panel.just a thought :oops:

[bozzzydmc]

Try this and see if she fires up as a temp fix .

[stunned_monkey]

What Mike said... which jumps the Brown to the White/Purple and puts 12v on the pump. You say you hear the click which suggests the RPM relay is working fine. The failure mode for them is simply not switching on.. you can hear yours. The problem is probably at the pump itself or at the fuse (one of the top row, I THINK without my diagram)

Do check the inertia switch, its plug, or could simply be the two-pin connector on the pump itself, which gets very dirty.

[Carl Hammond]

Cheers guys, I will give that test a try.

Might be next weekend before I get around to it though...

Will let you know how I get on.

Thanks

Kind regards

[Carl Hammond]

An update...well kind of!

I went into the garage last Sunday (a week on) to try her again, expecting there to be no change. However, on the first turn of the key, she almost fired, so I tried her again and sure enough she started up at the second turn of the key!

So, basically over the space of a week she managed to fix herself by just sitting there in the garage!

From then on, she was running beautifully that morning, so I decided to take her for a quick drive, went lika a dream. Got home and lined her up to park in the garage, thought I would give it a test, so I switched off the engine and left it for about 30 seconds, turned the key... she fired straight her up again, no problem!

BUT! We went back to her again a good 5 hours or so later, tried to start...and guess what...nothing! Cranked around a dozen times but no joy. So, once again we're back to square 1!

Funny thing is, I bet if I try her this morning she will probably go! I think you're right Tony, they are funny old cars! :lol:

I have to get this this sorted somehow, as it is unpredictable when and where it will happen next! I have been lucky that it happened on my own driveway both times so far...

Question: Would jump starting the car incorrectly be responsible for the
problems I am having? As when we did jump start the car back on Boxing Day I have a feeling we didn't do it correctly to start with, as I know we fried the temp gauge doing this!

Anyone had similar problems like this?

Thanks

Kind regards

[Tourettes Tony]

some times my car dont catch first time and if i keep turning it over i wont have it, but if i only let it turn over a couple of times then it is ok, are your leads ok try giving them a bit of wd my king lead was shorting out a while back and it was a pig to start tt

[Guinney1971]

Tourettes Tony Wrote:my king lead was shorting out a while back and it was a pig to start tt

I had the exact same problem with Flopsy, Tone. One minute fine, the next
didnt want to know.

RAC man discovered is was the king lead making a bad connection to the cap.

[Tourettes Tony]

yeah they are buggers, best way i found to find tracking was to check around engine bay in the pitch black of night and you can easily spot where its broken down TT

[Carl Hammond]

Hey everyone,

So, got out yesterday to have another good look at the car and see if I could rule out some of the problems.

Didn't take me long to find out the problem lies in the fuel pump or at least the fp electrics. I was suspicious of this to start with as I could not hear it prime whilst turning on the ignition, so not too surprised it is the culprit!

Anyway, I tried jumpering the RPM Relay (thanks for the tip Mike) and to start with no joy... Then I kind of started to wiggle the leads to the pump and all of a sudden it started working! Sure enough at the turn of the key she fired up on the button!

However, she was struggling as I sat there warming her up, the revs were up and down without my foot being on the pedal at all. She didn't stall though which was encouraging and I to my relief she drove back into the garage!

So, the question now is what I am needing to replace, the fuel pump itself, the connections, or is there potentially another cause here?

One other thing to note, the car is on just under a 1/4 feul and there does appear to be a little bit of water in the tank too.

Any advice on what I should do next?

Thanks

[Barson]

hi


my advice would be to evacuate the tank of all the fuel and water and clean it out, firstly.

How do you know if it's got water in the tank?

Not sure i would run the car with a fuel pump that has only intermittent contact at the connectors. I'm not saying that you could get a spark, but...

I'd re-crimp the wires with new connectors and if that doesn't give consistently good positive results, replace the fuel pump (and pick up filter while you're there.)

then check what the engine's doing with new gas and pump


cheers me dears.

[Pilot25dmc]

I had this same problem when I first got my car...

The white connector for the fuel pump uses male/female bullet connectors and over time they expand and dont make proper contact with each other.

My car would start and drive but then get spluttery and die, it would be impossible to start unless I took the access cover off and fiddled with the power wires, then first turn of the key she would start.

In the end I cut the connectors off and hard-wired the wires together, never had a problem since.

If you suspect your fuel pump then stick a multimeter on it and check the voltage, hell, if its an original then stick a new one in to be on the safe side!